It is sad what our hobby is doing to the reefs of the world, and especially when you realize that probably 98% of the fish caught won't make it.
responsible aquarist is not neccesarily the culprit. unchecked collections like that play a large factor in giving the hobby a bad name. if it was regulated and the importation was reduced then the live stock prices would go up. i would hate to pay more but on the same hand it would probably be more benefical to the trade. with livestock prices going up hobbiest would be more likely to do their home work and research what they buy to make sure it lives. alot of hobbiest get lazy on husbandry at the expense of our pets. i have done the same thing in the past. neglect a water change in a qt tank cause its just damsels and they will be ok. but wouldnt do the same thing in a reef tank with sensitive fish. i would much rather spread the word of tankbred specimens and proper care for everything we keep thriough clubs like this but lps's talk to more people then all the clubs could hope to and feed the new aquarist will joyfull bliss of owning a mini ocean without all the care details for the all mighty dollar. the resposible aquarist would probably make up 20-30 % of the total purchases and thats the problem imo. enough ranting.
But if there wasn't a demand,and this country is the biggest, they wouldn't have a outlet. I agree that it should be regulated, but it well never be because of local corruptionof politics. I had some dealings with puchasing land in Belize a few years back and it wasn't going through proper channels that got you somewhere, it was who you knew to give some money to. Couldn't agree more on the LFS thing and pet stores in general on birds and ferrets and the like.
If you think the hobby is so detrimental to the earth, why do you participate and contribute to the demand?
At times I wonder that myself, especially when I loose an animal, but I also realize that in the wild there is lots of hazards. I also always buy tank raised whenever I can over wild caught. Like Jason said responsable reef keepers aren't the problem. It is the people who see it in a LFS and aren't told how hard it is and how much it cost after you get a tank to maintain it and get the needed equipment for emergencies and most end up discouraged and quit but not without great cost of the animals caught. Also hopefully as progress is made in the hobby by responsable reef keepers we well be able to grow this stuff in captivaty and won't have to get it off the reefs. I watched that video and saw a bag full of moorish idols , that is just one example of a fish that should not be sold, especially in a LFS. I saw some others. Most goniopora's species of corals shouldn't be either and the list goes on. Like said above enough ranting.
being in this hobby responsibly we should be able to add to the list of available items for sale. of course there are always going to be species we cannot provide the right breeding grounds for like most tangs without 20,000. gallon tanks like my next one will be . but advances are being made every day in breeding other fish and corals. i think the real questions should be asked in the stores before we make the purchase. "can i keep this animal alive for its expected life span?" i know we have all seen fish in teh stores that we have bought because we know it had a better chance with us then some other new aquarist as well and we knew that we stood little chance for success with it as well. in reality if the lps's lost enough of them in their tanks they would quit stocking them. maybe thats what we should be looking at.
Amen to both of the above. One problem Jason is the LFS turns in a order and the wholesaler well send some things that weren't even ordered if they happen to have a load of them its part of doing business with the wholesaler and I can't imagine even many LFS's that would intentionaly order moorish idols, but yet there was a bag full.
i have tried replying to this topic twice with some stats i found but for some reason it will not post them. i pm'd the reply to jay to see if he can post it.
Wouldn't it be cool to someday see all reefers in the country take a single frag and make a man made coral reef off of the coast of Florida or where ever. It would be even better if it was a protected area to evaluate its growth and life it generates. Then the hobby is giving back to the earth just as it took away from it, and the hobby would not be looked down upon by certain groups.
I think that would be awsome a true man made reef all from frags. I hope I'm around if that were to ever happen.
Labman48076 posted this on rc Read This info before buying a Morish Idol sums up very well the difficulty of this fish. Plus of course they are not reef safe. I picked up tropical fish magazine Jan 2008 issue there is a very interesting article on idol's the other with 30 years experience tried to keep 6 of them and also tracked 382 that were sold the results are shocking. something to think about before deciding to add one to your tank author recommends minimum 200 gallon tank prefers 400 to 600 . if you are thinking about one I recommend finding the article found my copy at petsmart and if you wanted to barrow mine I would be willing to loan it out. author lost hers where the * is time survived less then a week 280 1-2 weeks 38 2 weeks to a month 15 1-2 months 6 2-6 months 5 * 1 year 12 1 to 2 years 7 ** 2-5 years 19 also read this article at least if you decide to try one it will give you could info.. BTW just because a lfs got it to eat frozen or flake does not mean that it's getting the nutrition it needs. Please read this article Keeping Zanclus Cornutus apparently this site has a filter that will not let you directly cut and paste form rc.
Nice post Jason, That sadly is probably the same % for most of the fish in that video because of wqhat we have been talking about above. Atleast the coral end is getting to where it is being bred by reefers, wouldn't it be nice if someday there was no need to remove any corals from the reefs, we could get all we wanted online from fellow reefers or in a club like ours. I have a few LFS ones, and most of them was frags raised by local reefers, this time, but most are tank raised frags from Ralph and Nate in this club and Adam from frags.org and ones I had on the reef up north. cheers
