Ren's 40gal Build

Hey everyone! I have finally decided to jump back into the deep of things and get something going!

Tank :

I am looking at getting the 40gal breeder going. I am either going with a custom made 40gal rimless tank (same dimensions as the breeder) or just purchasing the breeder from like Petsmart or Petco. I was able to find the 40gal breeder at Petsmart for $89.99, but the brand is Grreat Choice. I have never heard of that brand. But, I just called Petco and they have the 40gal breeder for $119.99 currently, but between December 28th and Jan 24th they are having the dollar per gallon sale. The brand that Petco carries is Tetra. Which would make the the tank $40.00 before any taxes. I may go that way, depending on the price quotes that I get back for the rimless. I would probably go with 1" and 3/4" holes drilled for

If I go the route of getting the tank via Petco - my question is this: Is it possible to pull the rims off of it and it still be strong and sturdy? Basically, would it affect it's durability and stablity?

This looks like it has gotten nixed and replaced with a 75 gal!!!

Sump :

In my previous 40gal breeder, I had a 20gal long tank that I had made the slats to make the fuge. It did the job well and provided me with a little extra cushion in the stand for various items to be added in there and hung on the sides of the tank or on the inside walls of the stand. So, a little DIY to help keep expenses down!

The setup I am getting comes with a sump!!!

Skimmer : (let's pull all that fish poop out!)

I keep going back and forth on what I would like to get for this. I really like Reef Octopus from my previous experience. For this set up, I am looking at the RO : 110int-Protein Skimmer. I found a guy that has Reef Octopus NW-150 for sale on Reef Central for $150 shipped. I contacted him via PM and he said that he has had it for a year, but it has only been used for 5 months. What do you guys think?

Lighting :

Boy, I go back and forth on this. I really like the ATI 24 Inch 6x24W T5 setup, but a lot of what I am reading is that LEDs are the way to go now? With a single LED set up, it would save money long term due to not having to change out bulbs, having to upgrade, and etc., but the up front cost for this is .... a little expensive for me. Then again, so are the ATI's.

If I were to go with the LED's, I am not sure which way I would go. The brand and etc. A friend of mine had provided me a link to Reef LED Lights and he currently has those over his 500 gal system. From my understanding is that they could be attached to an Apex controller for automation as well.

I really like the shimmer of the MH's, but their cost to up keep just simply is not worth it in my eyes. By the time I buy everything for a retro-fit, I may have just pulled the trigger on either the ATI's or the LED's.

Flow:

Previously, I had my hands on a Vortech and really enjoyed them. I would go back to having one or two of them. At first, I would probably start out with just a single Vortech MP10 Wired. I would couple the Vortech with the Koralia Evolution for awhile. Once I have recovered some of the cost from setting the tank back up, I would eventually move to two Vortech MP10's. I keep going back and forth between wireless and wired for the Vortech's.

Return Pump:

I believe that Eheim is still the way to go, as they do not provide tons of heat in the water and that is huge in my book. The cooler I can keep things, the better off we are! I am not quite for sure if this Eheim Compact Pump would suffice or if I should just go with the Eheim 1048 Pump, which provides 158gph output. What do ya'll think?

RODI :

I am looking at going through Bulk Reef Supply for my RO/DI. I am looking specifically at the 4 Stage RO/DI unit. It will provide me with the output that I am looking for considering my system is not going to be very big at all. If you folks have suggestions for a different unit, let me know! I am open!

Monitoring :

I will eventually be getting an Apex Jr.. I had one before and I loved it. Once I had everything set up, it never needed to be touched again, which is super nice. Depending on if I could justify the cost, I may go to the next system up from this only time will tell though.

I will be providing a cost analysis that will be updated to show the total investment that I have into my little "startup". Of course, this will adjust over time as I add to the system and etc.

 

So, I have been shopping around online for everything that I would need. Now, I am sure that this pricing structure that I have laid out is bound to change when things really start going, but eh - we'll see how it goes. I'll keep an updated list going. At any rate, so I will put sporadic updates of my costs throughout the build.

I did contact Brandon @ WUW (in Fayetteville) and he did quote me the 65 gal rimless today with stand for $625. I will upgrade to this at a later date, but I would like to get an established tank up and going, this way I am able to get some nice stuff going! Otherwise the build will take way entirely too long in my eyes! I thought you all were anxious for Loki's holes to be drilled, I could only imagine how you all would be on me to get water in mine! So, the 65 gal rimless is hold on - but I will be saving money to eventually get it and all that jazz! (jazz hands) As a result, I have opted to go with the 40 gal breeder from Petco. Now, Loki - you had mentioned earlier that you thought that the tanks were tempered glass and I did get some good news about this! I contacted Marineland directly (after confirming with Petco that it is a tetra tank, which is Marineland) that only the bottom of the tank is tempered glass. As a result, I can drill my holes for the overflow and return on the back panel of the tank! Talk about exciting news! I may pick up a second 40gal breeder, just in case the first one shatters or cracks and if it doesn't I can always return the other!

Everything that I have quoted out here in the price are all online pricing! So, let's see what we have here! I will be speaking with Brandon on Sunday to see if we can do some wheeling and dealing to help me get the costs down a little bit. Of course, I have not accounted for the stand in this pricing - because at the end of the day, I am not sure which method I am going to go. We have the local prison here that does a lot of stuff, including wood working. So - I am going to check to see if I were to buy all of the supplies and provide some plans for the stand if it would help save me some money. The nice thing about going this route is that there is no labor cost involved and the only out of pocket I have to pay is for the materials! I also did not include the cost of the plumbing that I will need, because as you all know it is all variable at the end of the day.

For the sump, I will be making it and putting in my own baffles.



As for lighting, I am still looking at my options available! I will throw up another price list that I have going at some other point for the "desired", but not required items that I would like to have. For the RODI, I am able to go through AWI to get the unit, the TDS, and Float Valve that I would need with the club discount, the $10 off any item in your cart, and the free shipping for $160! I say, not to Cory, that's a bad word and we don't allow it here. shabby!

At any rate - talk to me - tell me what you guys think!

 

On a side note - I did some researching for how it is that I would like my stand to look and I think I found something that I am pretty fond of. I would like some input here from a few of ya and tell me what ya think. As you can tell, I want to make sure I get good valuable feedback to ensure that everything is going to go according to plan and not be messed up!

I have been playing around with SketUp to get some ideas for how I would like the set up to go for the tank/stand. This is the first time that I have ever used SketchUp, so ignore some of the newbie stuff you may see! I am thinking that the stand will have the following dimensions 46" x 24" x 42". This would allow for the top of the tank to measure at 60". Considering I only stand 5'2" - I think this is a good setup to allow for me to be able look down into the tank from the top as well.

At an angle from the right (of my screen) :



At an angle from the left (of my screen) :



Front view without the doors on :



Read of the tank :

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The reason why I choose to tank the plumbing down through the back of the stand is to ensure that if there is ever an issue with the plumbing (I glue very well!), but I did not want the first thing for it to hit is my wall from under neath the tank. This way it allows for most of all the plumbing to be hidden under the tank. As for how I would like it to look aesthetically, I was browsing the RC's DIY Stands Template and Calculator and found some ideas that I think I would like to go with.


I like the simplicity of this design by Rocket Engineer @ Reef Central :

Front view :



Side view :

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I also came across this and thought that this would be fantastic as well. Instead of putting the doors onto hinges, making them to where they are able to be slide open for easy access to the front of the tank's underbelly. This would be just taking the front panel as a whole and doing this. That way if I needed to get in there and move the sump pretty easy, I am able to do so. Here's what I am talking about. For the side and I believe I may only do shelving on one side of the tank (to allow for my top off and etc., that this would be hinged without doubt. This way we are able to pull open the door to gain access to the shelves.

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I go back and forth between which return to actually use. I have heard great things about the Sicce pumps as well. I do plan on going with an LED lighting system, so heat really is not going to be a huge issue at all even with a mag 5. Unless that thing is giving out tons of heat, which it shouldn't.

The build itself is going to go slow, as I am building together my desired list. I want it to be nice from the get go and not have to keep buying things. So, I am sure it is going to take me a few months to have everything together. I think with the holiday season going on, I won't get water into the tank until about February sometime. After that I'll probably let it cycle for a good few weeks to get established (minus the lights). This will save me some time on getting the funds together for the expensive LED system that I am looking at. We'll see! I may go with some of the Shitbox LEDs for the time being and then slowly save up some money for the expensive ones. If I do go with the shitbox LEDs then, I would probably go with either a two fixtures or three. Of course this is all depending on the par readings that are coming off of them. We'll see though, we'll see.

 

I have a small update to make - nothing big and major other than to the wallet! Some purchases were made and I'm feeling the money just disappear!

There was a meeting at one of the stores up in Fayetteville, AR (about 1.5hrs from me), so I decided to go and check out some stuff at the store. While I was there grabbed a few things. Of course this wasn't the only purchases I made.

Worlds Under Water (Fayetteville, AR) :

• Reef Octopus 110INT - $190.00 + tax = $208.53
• CaribSea Fiji Pink Sand - $25.00 @ 3 + tax = $82.31
  • I could have saved some money by ordering online, but I figured it would be good to support a local fish store! Ultimately, I could have saved myself roughly $40!

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Seeing as how I was busy buying things, I figured I would take advantage of my Amazon Prime and the free shipping! I also hit up another vendor. I took the liberty of ordering the following:

Air, Water & Ice :

• Typhoon III RODI Reef w/ handheld TDS Meter - $189.95
• Float Valve - $12.95
  • AW&I is still doing their Cyber Monday sale, so I took advantage of the 20% offer that they were having for the Typhoon III 100gpd unit they have! Plus, I got free shipping!
  • Total was $162.32. Nothing like saving $40!!

Amazon :

• API Saltwater Reef Master Kit - $22.39
• Refractometer - $28.98
• Danner Mag 5 500 GPH - $58.57
• Jebao RW-8 Wavemaker with Controller - $68.80

Tonight, I did see the Kessil A360 in action. At WUW (where the meeting was held), they had a pretty large sized frag tank that was being lite by the Radeon's. Those are nice too. I'm going to debate which way I want to go. With the Kessil's I would need 2 of the fixtures for the 40 gal breeder; whereas with the Radeon, I would only need one! I'm still doing my research when it comes to the lights to figure out what it is that I want to do. I have heard that the Maxspect Razor systems are good too!

 

Yes, I only use the API to test usually during algae related issues and/or cycling. I'm not going to waste expensive tests for cycling! For the others, I definitely use Salifert without doubt. I liked their testing kit when I had them.

 

Merry Christmas to me! Merry Christmas to me! Look what got delivered this morning!

I got my shipments in from Air, Water, and Ice. Boy, this RODI unit is HUGE! It's much bigger than my last one - that's for sure!



I also got some shipments from Amazon! OH yea, got my Mag 5, Jebao RW-8, Refractometer, and the API test kit!






Update my expense sheet:



As you can see everything with a strike is already obtained.

 

I was on the hunt for someone to build me a stand for about a week. Considering I have none of the tools required to do it myself, I had to seek elsewhere. I contacted a few guys in the area and one dude quoted me $1700 to build the stand. At that price point, it better have a built in Apex along with full automation and the cycle needs to be complete. I was finally able to find me someone in the DFW area to build me one. I don't know if he is on this board or not, but he is on DFWMAS. His name is OMP. I loved his stand that he built, so I had reached out to him. Awesome guy to work with! He was able to get this started today for me! He was able to make some good progress on it and sent me an updated photo!

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I also placed an order for 30 lbs of dry-rock from Marco Rocks and I am expecting delivery on Tuesday! We will be in the metroplex (DFW) tomorrow and leaving on Monday, so I am planning on stopping by one of the stores there to pick up my salt while I am there.

 

Hey huntin! I thought I would show you what it is that I found here for the overflow. I am thinking of going this method for the overflow vs. having a huge box in the tank and then this way it is just simply a very low profile.

 

Here we are discussing as to how much outside of the "framing" of the stand do I want the skin to go for the opening of the door.

Top:

I decided to go ahead and have the skin go 3" (I believe) from the edge of the framing for the top and sides of of the door.


Bottom:

We decided that the skin for the bottom would run flush with the board. I made the decision to do it this way for ease of removal of the sump. I didn't want to have to fight a "lip" to get it in and out of if ever needed.


Overall stand status:

There was some debate as to whether or not to do one large door or break it up and do two. I ultimately decided to go with two doors vs. the one. There will be some trim put on the stand all the way around. I will have a 1.5" lip at the top of the stand.



Yesterday we went down to Dallas to visit family and to tend to some personal things. While we were there, I decided to stop by Petco to get two very much needed items. Look at what I came home with!



I got the 40 gal breeder and a 29 gal tall for the sump. I will be looking into making the baffles myself out of glass. I will be heading up to Lowe's sometime this week to get some silicone and the glass cut. Just got to do some measurements to figure out where I want my water line and etc. I decided to go with the 29 gal vs a 20 gal tank for the sump to ensure that I have plenty of room to avoid any kind of disaster and not have a flood if at all possible!

I have also e-mailed Marc (Melev) about seeing what he would charge for the low profile overflow that I found on-line. I'm wanting to compare the prices for them and figure out what I want to do! I have used Melev before, so I know his stuff is made really well.

An update on the lights :

Well, well .. well. I finally got an e-mail tonight from Rick at Reef Radiance. His ears must have been ringing or something. I wonder if he got some burning feeling to contact me back after I reached out to Stu and David @ Seafari about the lights that they mentioned. I'm still trying to figure out what to do. If I go with what it is that Rick is suggesting, I may need two lights. At that price point, I may as well go ahead and head on up to a radeon! We'll see what happens though. I'm still waiting on some information from Stu and David about the lights.

While I was working this morning, I was browsing the Equipment thread over on ReefCentral and found a post with a guy showing off a low-profile overflow. I have sent off an e-mail to this guy to see what he would charge for 24" in length with 3 drains for output. Let's see if he charges an arm and a leg. Just for giggles, I sent an e-mail off to Marc (Melevs Reef) and asked for a quote for this set up for the overflow. I am thinking this is going to be the best way to go considering I want to have as much real estate as possible!

I have a few more things on my list to obtain:

• Buy the tank. - Bought
• Buy the sump. - Bought
• Buy salt. - Ordered Aqua Vitro @ LFS.
• Buy Brute for mixing the water.
• Have glass cut for the baffles @ Lowe's for a DIY method - or use the guy listed above for the overflow, as he has a nice clean kit for baffles available via e-bay.
• Buy the bulkheads.
• DJ Control Panel.
• Purchase GFCI (grounded wall outlet)
• Buy all the plumbing needed.
• Purchase the sump lighting.
• Grab some cheato from someone!
• Get some rubble rock for the fuge.
• Get one piece of rock that is fully covered in coraline to seed the tank with it!
• Obtain lighting for the tank, but this is the last thing to come - considering I don't need it for the cycle!

Things to buy in the near future, but not necessary currently:

• ATO Reservoir.
• Auto Top Off mechanism.
• Dual BRS Reactor.
• Alk, Mag, Ca and etc. test kits.
• I am sure I am missing something else here.

My to-do-list:

• Determine if I am going to buy the sump set via e-bay or just do it DIY. I'll probably save some money doing the DIY method.
• Drive to DFW to pick up the stand. (Not to bad of a deal, as my sister lives there and I can do an overnight stay with it. Just depends on when it is ready and what is going on. I normally work 60 hours a week and I start classes on the 12th of Jan! Eeeegads!)
• Paint the interior of the stand with two coats of Kilz.
• Line the guts of the stand with a thick pond liner as a precaution!
• Pick out a stain and/or paint for the stand.
• Drill holes in the stand for the plumbing to go through.
• Switch out the wall outlet where we are going to be putting the tank to the GFCI.
• Plan the plumbing layout. I have a pretty good idea of what I would like to do.
• Figure out where I am going to connect the RODI. I am thinking over by the washer/dryer, but my wife is resisting me! We'll see!
• Drill the tank!

 

The reason why I decided to go with this type of overflow is for several reasons:

1. Provides more real estate for aquascaping.
2. More room for the fish to enjoy.
3. More room for corals to grow
4. Nothing massive in the tank taking up unneccessary room.

The internal component that goes into the tank does the exact same thing as a RR tank does. The only difference is that it also extends behind the tank. It is attached via the bulkheads, which is nice, I won't necessarily need to silicone it in place. I may ultimately decide to do that just for ease of mind, but it is not something that is needed. Seeing as how I plan on doing my plumbing behind the tank anyways, I figured might as well see if I can get something like this to prevent anymore bends in the piping if necessary.

Hunt, I like the beananimal overflow method for several reasons. It has a built in safety so to speak to help prevent any possible chance of flooding. Which is huge for me or anyone for that matter. You can find more information by heading over to Bean's site. Lots of explaining into his madness!

 

My wife had been on me about going out to the shed and seeing what items I had left from when I left the hobby. I knew I had a small collection of things, but as to what was the questino! So, off I went today out to the shed (figured today was a good day as we took down all the Christmas stuff and was putting it away) and found my box of goods. Here's what I found!

• NIB Titanium Heater from ViaAqua
• Used Titanium Heater from ViaAqua - Will not be using
• Brinks digital timer
• Fishing Nets
• Chauvet PC-09 Power Supply
• Revive Coral Cleaner
• Kent Marine Nitrogen Sponge that is 3/4ths full (yay for me!)
• Salifert Mag and Ca test kits that expired in Jan 2014 - - Will not be using
• Magfloat cleaners of various sizes

I'm super happy I did keep some stuff. I was not looking forward to paying another $35-$40 bucks for another power supply strip, let alone the cost of the other items. I have probably saved a good $100 bucks or so by having all of these items. As you can see, having some of this stuff is nice and allows me to save a little bit of money. I did confirm that the Brinkers timer and the power supply strip is working still after being stored in a nice cold shed.

• Buy the tank. - Bought
• Buy the sump. - Bought
• Buy salt. - Ordered Aqua Vitro @ LFS.
• Buy Brute for mixing the water.
• Have glass cut for the baffles @ Lowe's for a DIY method - or use the guy listed above for the overflow, as he has a nice clean kit for baffles available via e-bay.
• Order the overflow.
• Buy the bulkheads.
• DJ Control Panel. Already had
• Purchase GFCI (grounded wall outlet) - Ordered from Amazon
• Buy all the plumbing needed.
• Purchase the sump lighting.
• Grab some cheato from someone!
• Get some rubble rock for the fuge.
• Get one piece of rock that is fully covered in coraline to seed the tank with it!
• Obtain lighting for the tank, but this is the last thing to come - considering I don't need it for the cycle!

I got a nice delivery today that was waiting by the backdoor when I woke for my afternoon shift today at work. Fedex had left my package from Marco Rocks. I had some nice sized pieces in there. Two of three pieces had actually had a piece break off due to the shipping, but that is always bound to happen! Because of the breaks in the rock, I will have a little bit of rubble available from the rock that I got. I still plan to get a coraline covered piece to throw in to help seed the tank with it.



I think I have settled on a light. I have been in communication with David over at Seafari about an LED. Final confirmation of this will be made in a week or so when I go up to pick up my salt and get my tank drilled!!! I am still trying to determine if I should do a coast to coast overflow and do all the plumbing and put bends in the plumbing or if I should go with the ghost overflow that I found on e-bay. The e-bay guy is out of the country until the 7th. Marc isn't able to do the ghost overflow, but can do the coast to coast. Marc also suggested an external durso stand to be used, but not sure if I want to go this way. I really like everything that I have read about the beananimal method. I like having the extra "fail safe" in place.

 

On my break last night, I opened up the skimmer for the first time to inspect it to see how much the Reef Octopus' have changed since I got the NW-150 back in the day before I sold it off. I was very impressed with everything that I saw.

Nothing like a photo to show off the goods!



I also had some time to figure out exactly how it is that I want to do the plumbing. Now, keep in mind that I will be using a low profile overflow setup. Guess you could say, the ghost overflow. As a result, the external box is outside the tank. Here is what i have worked up so far.

• Red = emergency / fail safe
• Green = drains
• Purple = returns

My plan for the returns is to T it off and have it split. This way I am getting plenty of flow all the way around and hitting all spots and having some of the surface broke up at the top on both sides of the tank. My question for this though is would a Mag 5 be enough power for what I am wanting to do? Sorry that the photo is a little crooked, but you get the point.

 

I will be doing a fuge in the sump. The reason for the dual returns would be for more water agitation and to get some flow behind the rock work as well. I have the jebaeo rw8, so that should provide plenty of flow within the tank, but I want to make sure I'm getting all areas of the tank covered.

I will eventually be adding a dual reactor from BRS. For carbon and GFO. For the return I can always dial back as I plan on having a valve on that line to ensure it's not going full force and nuts with things. I will have gate valves on one drain and on the return line. I do not believe it is necessary to have it on all three drains.

As for the design of the plumbing. I will drop two drains into the skimmer section. Probably the emergency drain and the main drain. Then I'll drop the secondary drain into the fuge area. I have been discussing this on the BA RC thread, along with some buddies. Currently I have it set to go skimmer > fuge > return and may end up going skimmer > return > fuge. This way the return is pulling water from both the skimmer and fuge sections at the same time. I also do not plan to have any 90 degree turns. I will go with 45 degree angels and will go with flex tubing for under the tank.

Something like this: