LR in Sump

Discussion in 'Beginning Reefers' started by Eric, May 25, 2017.

  1. Eric

    Eric Plankton

    I have an idea to put more live rock in my sump. Currently I have a small fuge in the middle with live sand, rock and some macro algae (plan to add more macro). I would like to add some more live rock in the return section of the sump (Could probably add about 3 to 5 more pounds), currently its empty.

    I have opted not to run socks...lazy and don't like the idea that its collecting good stuff too.

    Opinions? Is this a bad idea?
     
  2. I don't know how large your tank is. 3-5lbs of rock does not seem like much rock. Would that make a difference in a small tank? Maybe?

    Have you considered ceramic options like http://www.bulkreefsupply.com/marinepure-ceramic-biomedia-1-1-2-spheres.html. Likely would give you far greater surface area and denitrification.

    Dont be lazy and add socks. Change them once a week. Socks catch tons of large debri and keeps from accumulating. Once a week changing won't leach heavey amts of N and P.
     
    LJC6780 likes this.
  3. Eric

    Eric Plankton

    Its a 50 gal with a about 10 gals in the sump. Probably have about 40 gal total water with 30 lbs of live rock in DT and 5-6 lb in fuge. So total 35 lbs of live rock. I would like to get above 40 by adding to the sump.

    I had ceramic in there before but didn't like it. Its not natural. Yes I know it provides more surface area but still not natural.

    Yes I know and I did have them on their at the beginning but took them off to see what would happen. 3 weeks later...no change. Keep in mind, I do not have much life in the tank yet. Still new and adding slowly.

    When I did have socks, it did catch a lot of debris but most of that is food for the very basic of life in the tank. Also, I would prefer to keep it as natural as possible...never seen socks in the ocean and they would have to be massive to work if they were there.;)
     
    SilentReefer likes this.
  4. Natural? Glass box? The sentiment is well placed. I guess your skmmerless? Look that up before you rebuttle the ocean produces foam ;)

    Yes add all the LR in the sump you can squeeze in.
     
    huntindoc and LJC6780 like this.
  5. Eric

    Eric Plankton

    :)No of course not, Skimmer pulls too much out of the water and it was a little sarcasm.

    I did add a bottle of pods to the tank with the socks on about 2 weeks ago. Then I saw way too many pods in the socks when I we to change them out. Feel like I shot myself in the foot!

    Yep, I agree but didn't want to add more in that section of the sump if it may cause problems down the road.
     
    SilentReefer likes this.
  6. LJC6780

    LJC6780 Grouper

    I use socks. I recently switched to mesh socks and they are much better so far. At least they are much easier to clean! I don't like the idea of having to clean around my rocks in the sump (I have lots of rubble and frag plugs) because I suck up too much chaeto and pods and even saw a tiny star that I almost sucked up. I run a Skimmer too. I avoid just catching the food by turning off pumps and sump pump for about 30 minuts to feed fish then turning on my power heads for a few minutes for anything dropped to be suspended for the fish or corals to grab then I start the sump pump again. This reduces waste and I've never seen food chunks (I feed frozen mostly) in the socks. Or pods. Maybe one or two pods.
     
    SilentReefer likes this.
  7. Brian

    Brian Blenny

    what is a pod?
     
  8. Brian

    Brian Blenny

    when I bought my socks, they came with a pretty good rating and a lot of purchases. Now I never saw anything advertised as a mesh sock. The socks I have, the instructions say to put through the washing machine, since I have two, I would think that I could do one a week, just alternating. How are mesh socks cleaned? Everything I have read says to turn off the pumps before feeding, to avoid the food in the sump thing.
     
    LJC6780 likes this.
  9. Brian

    Brian Blenny

    Every current sump design I have scene, has socks
     
  10. Brian

    Brian Blenny

    From what I have been able to find out, lbs of live rock does not always dictate size live rock. Some is lighter than others apparently. Regardless of size, it still seems to be sold by the lb, so instead of lbs of live rock, you might be limited by size of place you have to put the live rock. Is lighter, bigger live rock better than heavier, smaller live rocks? I don't know the answer to that. I have seen several articles that state to put little crumbles and pieces of live rock in your refugium section. That way, you get value for every lb you by. There is live rock, cultered live rock, harvested live rock (illegal?), dry live rock that must be seeded to turn into live live rock, and not to be left out, apparently you can make your own live rock. Sometimes you must boil live rock, sometimes you must pressure wash live rock (what about the detergent in your pressure washer?), sometimes you dont want to kill whatever benefit from the live part of live rock. If there is a live rock wiki, it must be 100 pages long with several contradictions. Flip a coin and try whatever you want.
     
  11. LJC6780

    LJC6780 Grouper

    Well detergent is not required to use a pressure washer. I don't think I've ever used it in mine. And by washing the rock, it is no longer "live." Live means it is inhabited with bacteria and pods and other living creatures to aid in the breakdown of waste. Pods are short for copepods, amphipods etc ... BRS has done an interesting test on the porosity of different types of rock but I don't remember the results ... I actually just got some marine pure balls to add to my sump along with the matrix and rubble. I'm getting rather stocked with corals and want to add some more fish and looking for more filtration because I have no idea how many lb of rock I have. Plus, I've got close to 100 gallons of water (minus rock) and I doubt I have near that in lbs.

    Oh and be careful boiling rock. If you even THINK there could have been zoas or palys on them it could be extremely toxic with the fumes or even the container used to boil. I personally would use acid to wash rather than boiling. JIC.

    I found the "felt" or "wool" (even though it's all polyester) socks to be quite difficult to clean, even in the washer, because the 4" is rather hard to turn inside out and the solid gunk stays inside the sock. Here are the mesh socks I currently use and like. I just spray them out with the sprayer on the sink and then soak in powdered hydrogen peroxide (can't remember the chemical name) or bleach. My sump runs 2 socks so I have 4 of these and 2 that I really don't like as much because of the stitching design.

    Nylon Mesh Filter Sock -200Micron- Aquarium Filter/Media Bag - 4 Pack https://www.amazon.com/dp/B06XY5ZK9J/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_CGXvzb6FS5BJM
     
    Last edited: Jun 30, 2017
  12. Brian

    Brian Blenny

  13. LJC6780

    LJC6780 Grouper

    You can get live rock with no hitch hikers. It will still have the beneficial bacteria though. It is just rock that has been previously washed then cycled in a tank with no critters. But the bacteria makes it live. The rock itself is not live but the bacteria (and any critters) are live, so we call it live rock. Dry rock is dry. Sometimes it's already cured (washed and ready to go) but not cycled and live with bacteria because it's dry. Sometimes you have to cure dry rock and remove all of the dried corals and dead organisms. This is where an acid bath comes in handy. I've heard of people using vinegar or muriatic acid. Just know the longer you leave it in the more calcium will dissolve. A stiff scrub brush can really come in handy here. Some people just soak it in a bin for days/weeks then rinse off anything that is left. There are different methods for curing rock, wet or dry.

    The only rock I've used is some I got with tank purchases. I haven't bought anything separately because I had plenty.

    And I have the shorter socks because my sump isn't that tall. And the longer ones would just wad up at the bottom. Maybe it's because hey are shorter but I find t extremely difficult to turn inside out with the felt ones. The mesh ones are so much easier for me to clean. I change them out twice a week. And it's sodium percarbonate that I soak them in. Couldn't think of the name before.
     
  14. Brian

    Brian Blenny

    Thank you for the info... Do you know the difference between cultured live rock and just plain live rock?? Why is the purple rock more valuable?
     
  15. LJC6780

    LJC6780 Grouper

    I think the cultured is that done in a tank with no hitch hikers and all ... general live rock I think is usually maricultured and can come with a myriad of critters. I could be completely wrong here but that's how I think of it. Also, I really don't know why the purple rock is so desireable ... although, I THINK I may have some in my tank that came with it. Except it's more blue. I actually like how they look but I'm not sure if it's painted or some sort of algae covering it.
     

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